THERAPY IN MOTION | COUPLES EDITION | VINCE & PARRIS PART TWO

KING OJ BRINGS A SPECIAL EPISODE OF THERAPY IN MOTION AS HE SITS WITH VINCE & PARRIS HOST OF THEIR PODCAST" FOR BETTER OR WORSE AND THEN SOME" HE LEARNS THEIR STORIES AND HOW DIFFERENT THEY WERE WHEN THEY MET. THEY SHARE THEIR INSIGHT ON TRAUMA AND HEALING AND GROWING WHILE SUPPORTING EACH OTHER. PART TWO IS SOOOOOO GOOD SO LISTEN NOW CAUSE PART TWO WILL BE AMAZING!!!

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Welcome back to another episode. This is part two, therapy in motion. We got a couple of therapy running and back with Vincent Paris. Um, there was a lot that we needed to touch on that I ain't get to yet. Um, we had a great first episode. Yeah. Yeah. So first off, I want to start off with that wellness check. How y'all feeling tonight? Baby.

SPEAKER_03 0:27

You're gonna give it to me.

SPEAKER_00 0:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 0:29

I'm feeling uh better now. Um work is work, but it's good to not be there. So I'll I'm I was looking forward to this while I was there. So I'm good. Good now.

SPEAKER_01 0:43

Nah, this is up. Um I'm good, man. Just uh celebrated the birthday, you know, Easter, man. Just turned 37, man. So feeling blessed. Happy B Day too. Yeah, man, appreciate it, man. Feeling blessed, feeling uh grateful, you know what I'm saying? A little bit hot right now from you know the pre-conversation before the pie we was talking about, you know what I'm saying? We get that pie to y'all soon enough, you know what I'm saying? Gotcha. But uh, but yeah, man, it's been it's been a good week, man, just you know, uh reflecting on 37 years and uh being able to um be here, man, and and still be here and and have my health and everything else, man.

SPEAKER_00 1:29

So do you feel any different? Like uh as the years go by, each year do you feel like you in a different like mindset or like a different atmosphere at all?

SPEAKER_01 1:43

I got a different back for sure. Back been going every year, you know what I'm saying? Nah, but uh but uh you know what I'm saying, but uh nah man, is is it's it's one of the things, man. I think the older I get, like this year, man, um, you know, I went out, went to church, went with the family, man. We went to go see the Super Mario movie. Um and then, you know, went to go see some fam and then came home. And for me, that was it. Like I was good. You know what I'm saying? I felt satisfied. Whereas, you know what I'm saying, you put me in like 18-year-old body, I'd been like, man, more, turn up, you know what I'm saying? So it's like I'm learning to appreciate the simple things, man, the the small things, and you know, I think it was just good being with my wife and my daughter, man, and not worrying about if people was gonna show up to something, and then nobody coming. I'm sitting there feeling all salty, like, don't nobody love me. Man, don't I rock with Vince? You know what I'm saying? And and instead it was like, man, I was with the two most people who loved me most. So it was like it was good, you know what I'm saying? And it was chill, and and it didn't, you know, just seeing my daughter light up watching the movie was like, hey, that's the best I can ask for, bro. You know what I'm saying? So I think oh, as I get older, man, I'm just learning to appreciate things a little bit more differently.

SPEAKER_00 3:17

So, uh, one, I do want to know, how was that movie though? Because I was thinking about taking the kids to see it myself. Man, kids go love it.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Okay. You know what I'm saying? You might like it in the first half, but I don't know about you, but like too much kid movie, my brain started dulling out like it started feeling like cotton candy, you know what I'm saying? I'm just like, I don't know, I halfway through it, I was like, man. She was like, you know, Kobe needs some water. I was like, I'm gonna go get it. Yeah. I'd rather walk to the fountain machine than to keep watching this movie. Like, my brain is going slow, so but the first half of that movie, man, it was just good, you know. But it is a good movie. Kid, it was a lot of kids in the theater we was in, and they was turned. It was turned, they was enjoying it. So and and and granted, though it's not obviously my type of movie, it was a good movie for kids. If I was their age, oh bro. Yeah. If we could have got this one, we was young, yeah, man. Versus the the live action BS they gave us as kids. Or man, what I would have been took that Super Mario movie. What? Man, yeah. Uh did you wind up seeing that first one that uh came out a couple years ago? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I seen I didn't see that one uh in person. I I ended up watching that one on screaming. But yeah, my daughter, she was she was excited to see this one because she had seen the previous one a thousand times. So she was ready for this one.

SPEAKER_00 4:47

Okay, yeah, that's what's up. I uh wound up taking the kids to see that one a couple years ago. It was it was actually dope. So I'm like, I think they'll be looking forward to this one too.

SPEAKER_01 4:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:58

So just you know, yeah, taking them on out there.

SPEAKER_01 5:01

She's ready for that Sonic 4 now. That's what she's waiting on. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Yeah, I'm I'm lost on that one. I think the second, maybe the second one. Okay. After that, yeah, the second one was cool. That the third, I wasn't really rocking with that. It was just, it threw me off too many times throughout the whole movie, and I'm just like, hiding candy brain. I know this for kids, but I still like cartoons myself, so it's like you still be wanting it to make some sense.

SPEAKER_01 5:33

Yeah, like cotton candy brain. I'm telling you, I was just like, mm-hmm. There was only one moment in the in the movie, and I won't spoil it, but there was only one moment that was like a nostalgic moment that I popped for, and I was like, oh, that's cool. Yeah. And then after that, dude, cotton candy brain. I was like, this is not cool. Yeah. But you know, the for her, it was worth it was worth the time.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

But yeah, I ain't gonna hold you. I'm probably going to see uh that Toy Story 5 without the kids. Hey.

SPEAKER_03 6:02

She's excited about that one too. Like she done got caught up.

SPEAKER_01 6:05

Not that.

SPEAKER_03 6:07

All of them. She's like, look, it's Toy Story 5.

SPEAKER_01 6:10

Toy Story. I'm gonna do the early morning show by myself.

SPEAKER_03 6:14

When the kids come in.

SPEAKER_01 6:15

When they all in school, and then I'm gonna do the afternoon with her after I done seen it already. Because for sure, Toy Story, that's for me.

SPEAKER_02 6:23

Yeah. That's for me.

SPEAKER_01 6:24

That's for me. It ain't even for her. She don't even know that for me. Yeah. They still making them for us.

SPEAKER_00 6:31

Man, look, when we used to uh be at be at the retail joint, and I had a couple homegirls, they like, what you want for your birthday? I'm like, Toy Story, the first one. They like, what? I'm like, no, dead ass. I want the first toy story. You know what I'm saying? Like, you bullshitting, what you want for real? I'm like, nah, that shit cost$59 and I'm not paying for that. Toy story. If y'all could get it for me, dead, we good.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

You know what I'm saying? Bro, I have still to this day, I gave it to Kobe. I have an original uh Woody toy. Yeah. From like when I was a kid when it first came out. The first one.

SPEAKER_00 7:15

So yours got the ball spot on it, like the real Woody now? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:21

Arthritis in the knees and everything. That's crazy. That's that boy from McDonald's. Man. They had it on 30 years.

SPEAKER_00 7:31

Man, no, but that's what's up, though. Yeah, man. So let's get on into this. Let's get down to the nitty-gritty. Yeah, let's do it, man. Let's do it. Let's do it. Alright, babe. So let's see what we're gonna start with. Uh I wanna know what uh matter of fact, what does 50-50 mean to you, Vince? Cause that been the that been the talk. Like a lot of people going back and forth. Of course, I don't necessarily want to speak on it because other people do it, but I just want to know y'all's perspectives on it. Like, what does it actually mean? And for us to have real dialogue, I know it's not just about to be a barking section. Like, you know what I'm saying? Everybody else I done heard speak on it. It just be like a crazy back and forth where nobody really getting to the point, or you know what I'm saying? Like they just all over the place with it.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Right, right, right. No, that's fact. Um, I think for me, man, 50-50. I don't even I don't even think I I live in 50-50. I feel like any solid relationship is a hundred-a hundred. We we both care about these bills. We both need to make sure our our kids is fed. We both need to make sure that we take care of ourselves and our clothing in our in our home. Like everything is a hundred percent, hundred percent. I care about it just as much as you do. Yeah, and we go work at it together. Yeah, it ain't like, oh, this your have to take care of that, this your have to take care of that. It's like this gotta get done. How do we do it? Right. And that takes a hundred percent, hundred percent effort. Facts. So it's like 50-50 to me is I think it's more of a modern term of trying to make sure that people feel validated and respected in their relationship because men feel taken advantage of financially, women feel taken advantage of um more domestically, and so everybody is just saying, well, 50-50, because that way everybody feels entitled to make sure that their voice isn't overstepped or over, you know, or being underappreciated. But for me, it's like it was a hundred hundred. I don't it ain't oh, like the car payment gotta get done, you pay that. Yeah, I pay this over here. It's like, bro, we we gotta pay both. Facts. They not one bill ain't calling me and calling you, it's calling us.

SPEAKER_00 10:21

Facts.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

The male don't just kind of like come to my walk up to me and say, excuse me, sir, I'm your male, I'm your bill. The bill say our name, Parker's on the bill. Right. So it's both of our. Right. The fridge ain't like only open up for the master. Like the fridge opened up for both of us. We both gotta figure out how to fill it. Like, so it to me, honey, honey though. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? So um, I think people, again, like I say, it's more so about people wanting to make sure that they don't get disrespected, taken advantage of, or underappreciated. So that 50-50 is, you know, that middle ground for those those type of conversations. But I think when you truly care about somebody, that person cares about you, you guys are both building the same life. Yeah, that's the problem. Most times people got 50-50 because they're not building the same life. Right. I got I'm trying to do this over here, and you want to do this over here. And so because we're not in alignment, we try to make sure, well, you ain't about to ruin my life. Man, we got the same life. This is our life. So we on the same page 50-50 where. Right. You know what I'm saying? So I just look at that as um a more ignorant conversation people have in relationships that don't really have gravity and weight to them. Um, but that's not how we operate. At least for me. I mean, now she may answer and tell you. I was gonna say everything to bring up. Then I'm realized, like, oh, this was 50-50. For me to add. Oh, okay. She said everything that I was gonna say. But give it from a woman's perspective, because as a woman, there are women who who probably feel like you shouldn't be 50-50 with your man. There's there are women, there's a there's a female pressure of like you should be getting well taken care of, and you shouldn't have to work. And you and and so when you start to look like, oh no, me and my man, we make decisions together, we work together, da-da-da. I mean, that's a pressure that you have to balance for yourself so that you don't feel like is it is are they right?

SPEAKER_03 12:37

But see, that's the thing, and I think that's part of the issue with some of these conversations is it it's I think it depends on the individual. Like, if if if certain women want to live a certain lifestyle, they might be more, they might lean more towards okay, 50-50.

SPEAKER_01 12:53

Right.

SPEAKER_03 12:53

Because if I want to continue to live in a lifestyle I lived before I got in a relationship with you, now being in a relationship with you could possibly change that. No, no, no, we gotta do 50-50 because I still want to get my hair done when I want to get I want to still do all the things and have you too, but that's part of the sacrifice of being in a relationship, getting married. Like again, that's you might not have that initially, because again, y'all trying to establish stuff, y'all trying to figure stuff out. That might be something you can add in here and there eventually, right? But it's like you're not gonna have that 50-50 all the time, like you're gonna have to be flexible if anything.

SPEAKER_01 13:34

For sure. You mean financially? Yes, yeah, yeah, it's not always 50-50. I don't think it is always 50-50. I think sometimes it's it's 70-30, sometimes it's uh 100 one way. You know, one person can be like, but again, is it our life or is it just your life? Right. You know what I'm saying? And I think that's where that 50-50 starts to deteriorate because even if there's a woman that's like, oh, or even let's say you say, hey, I wanna, I don't want to work. That has to be both of our goals. That can't just be something you want to do now, I have to meet it. It has to be something that I'm like, okay, I want that for, I want that for you too. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_03 14:15

Or but it still requires both of us to make that happen. Make it happen. Or if not now, maybe in a year or two. Right.

SPEAKER_01 14:25

Save this amount or work towards it. I might need you to work for another five more years before I could do that for you.

SPEAKER_03 14:30

Yeah, I will admit, I think initially you think that that like is the reality of it. But once we got married, and then like once we I got pregnant, that kind of went out the window. Like that 50-50 thinking it's gonna stay like that all the time. Right. Just because again, I was on maternity leave, you had to go to work. Right. Or you were the only one working at the so it's just on a day-to-day, yeah. Even if I wanted to, I literally could not. So you had to kind of carry the load for those three months that I was on maternity leave. Now, granted, I was like taking care of Kobe, but it's like a switch off. For sure. Um, and there's only so much you could do, you know, because she was a newborn. So again, it's kind of like you can help here and there, for sure, but naturally, you know, I just gotta do what I gotta do for her those first few months.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

But so do y'all feel like it's more so of a um a non-love factor in there? Like for what so what I mean basically, I don't think people actually be loving their partner for real or respect their partner. So I think that's why that becomes a crazy debate instead of it just being like a conversation and yeah, like a small topic. Instead, it'd be like people get animosity and anger and yeah, it be getting heated. Yeah, like yeah, what 50-50? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like it damn near turn into a shootout all because you ask somebody to bring something to the table. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Oh my god. And a lot of it, I think, is again, like, people do not think for themselves. Yeah. So there's a lot of society pressure that's put on people, especially women, to think like, oh, if he don't meet these requirements. I always say it all the time, like, women are always trying to tell men how to be men, and then get mad when men start telling women how to be women. Right. And then, and so we we get pissed at each other for trying to define our roles. Right. When it's like this, this is just go be the roles, just understand the role. So when you have that happening, you have women, you have women who are put under this pressure of like, oh, if it's 50-50, girl, you losing. Yeah, you getting short change. It's women out here getting 70, 30, 100 all the way, and you 50-50. You must got you one of those type of men. Them them. And so you start feeling that pressure as a woman. Same thing for a man, where it's like, oh, you 50-50, man, you know. I remember talking with uh uh somebody, you know, and they was like, Yeah, you know, I just didn't want my wife to work. Yeah. I'm like, I need her to work. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, I'm glad you didn't want her to, because I want her to. You know what I'm saying? Because uh because and so it's like there there's just something of it's like as a man, you get shamed for it by like, oh, you couldn't meet the standard. Yeah, like the standard is somehow all of a sudden it's either you you take your wife out of work. Yeah, so when you can't do it, it's like, ah, bruh, you just can be you couldn't be a whole man. Yeah, you 88, 80 man, yeah, you 80% man, because you make more than her or you don't make more than her. 50% man though. You know what I'm saying? It's like, bro, it's like I'm a hundred percent man, whether she makes more than me, whether we 50-50, whether, because that's not what defines me as a man, just like her being the my wife being the us being 50-50, even though it's not our thing. Does not make her less a woman, doesn't make her in a worse predicament than the next woman, doesn't, but these are these weird things that people have come up with to the gauge and determine what's a good relationship or what's a good marriage. And it's like everything but that is what's gonna determine what's a good marriage. There are people, there are men who take care of their woman 100% and they the shittiest men walking. It's women who stay at home and and they you think they housewife of the year and they sleeping with every man while they man at work. Like there's there's no promise that these fulfillments are going to guarantee that the person you're with ultimately ends up being the person you need in your life. So I I I hate the 50-fitty conversation.

SPEAKER_03 19:07

And again, if you look at Hollywood, all these people, they have all the money that you would think necessary to just have a good, lavish life. Great point. And there's so many divorces, so many marriages that don't make it, so many relationships don't make it. Yep. People in a relationship one day, then they break, break, break up, and they with somebody else the next day. It's like if you really look at like the if you're trying to make finance the big thing that makes a marriage or relationship, we look at these people every day, all day, they have it. And it's just like that's not a guarantee, that's not a good indicator that your relationship will make it. Will it alleviate some of the day-to-day stresses and frustrations? Sure. Right. But at the end of the day, are you with a solid person? Because if the person is solid, that stuff is gonna come eventually. Right. It's just y'all both have to like weather the storm to get there.

SPEAKER_01 19:58

Yeah. It's like people say with money, like we were talking about a couple nights ago when we was watching a couple, it's a show called Couples Therapy. And uh, we've been watching it now for like four seasons, and it's different couples that actually sit in therapy and deal with real problems. And we was just talking about like how successful these couples have to be to be on this show because one, the show takes place in New York, which is an expensive city, sure, and then two, they wouldn't necessarily be interviewing average Joe Bro people on this show. So these gotta be some well off people, and so but I was we was just talking about like even when you get more money, the struggle then becomes maintaining what all this more money has gotten you. Because when you don't got a lot of money, you got you a little Honda Civic. Right, you got more money, now you got you a jag, but you gotta find the money to keep the jag. Right. You got a bigger house, now your property taxes is through the roof, or your mortgage is through the roof, so you gotta find the money to keep the house. So it's like or insurance for the house. All that's the shift. The bigger the house, the more the insurance is where you live, the top of the all of that. All that stuff. Yeah, so it's like people think like, oh, you know, financially leveling up is always gonna be this great thing, and it can be, but it also requires more maintenance, and now either I'm working more and I'm not home as a man, or she's working more, or whatever the case may be. But then those things start to affect the core of what your marriage is and and all. Relationship. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:38

Yeah. I think a lot of people don't uh they'll be right there by your side and then still act like they don't know the the obstacles that you are going through currently, and they'll still put your feet to the fire, like, why you ain't doing this? Why you ain't doing that? Right, right. It's like they're not uh understanding. Or not trying to be understanding to in reality, if you work in a regular nine to five, they really only pay us enough to make it to and from work. And maybe buy lunch. Like they don't pay us enough to pay life insurance for all of our members. Like just us and the kids. Not even saying like outside of like our immediate family, but like and barely one kid. Right. Let alone if you have multiple. Right. Then don't let that one kid be a smoker. And then it's like you really can't. Oh my god. If that one kid five smoking cigarettes, it's it's kind of over with. Yeah. So it's like, come on, bro. Then you gotta think, okay, let's say rent or mortgage. Sometimes your rent will be higher than the mortgage. Yeah. So it's like, damn, you might be paying. Like, for example, I had one apartment some years ago where my initial uh rent was$900, right? Uh, we got new management. They upped my rent literally the next go round from$900 to$1350. She's they be increasing it. Right. And I'm just like, come on. And how is it that the cost of living is going up so rapidly? But then they'll tell you, oh yeah, extra quarter should do. Minimum wage, extra extra quarter, that'll pay all of that.

SPEAKER_01 23:32

Like, oh, you got a bonus this month, an extra$50. She like, oh, and then they tax. They tax. Like, what? Oh, yeah, we're taxing. So technically that$50 is now$10.50. Man. Like, what? You don't even feel that quarter. Man, it's it's it's crazy because you sit there and you be like, if you if you really tried to go for the fences and get everything, your dental, your vision, your this, your that, you like you say, you premium this, you woo-doo-woo. Then when you get your check, you like, I don't even have enough to live now. You owe them. I done I done gave this to everything. So it's like, that's why I had to start putting it in perspective. Like, some things I just gotta accept. It don't matter. Yeah. I can't, you know, we've always we talk back and forth a lot of times about getting homelessness, man. And and I understand the importance of it. Can't afford it though. Mm-hmm. Can't afford it. Like, do I want to be paying that every month knowing that that takes away from the ability for us to eat? That takes away from the ability for us to be able to get back and forth. That takes away from the ability to be able to buy clothes when we outgrow them. Like, would it like it'd be like this house insurance thing gonna have to just not be a non-grata until until we can get wherever in life? Because when you look at what we make, what we're already coming out of just to live, man, we don't have enough for extra good stuff like this over here or that. No, we can't do it. Can't do it, or else we gotta start cutting stuff that we desperately actually need. And so you it's sad that we live in a country where we have to make those type of choices. And the the money that flows day to day through corporations and XYZ, I mean, you don't make that in a lifetime, what they make in a day, right? Some corporations make more in a day than you do in a lifetime, and then pay you enough to only get you through a week. Man, not even that. Not even that. Not even that. That's it. Bro, it's like I've worked and like got paid, yeah, took care of all the essentials, and then was like, what I'm supposed to do with this now. The rest is like, this is to get back to the job again for another two. Like, hey, so it's just like, man, it's it's it's it's unfortunate, man. That's why it's like I that's why I say the 50-50 thing don't matter because when we in this together and we we partner for life for this, yeah, then everything that's coming our way isn't a well, this is yours and this is mine, and that's your problem, and it's my problem. It's a this is a we problem. Right. And we together will figure this out because if we don't, we both go be on the street. Yeah. We both go be hungry, we both gonna be sitting here in the dark. So it's like we both need to care at the same level and rate, which means the 50-50 thing doesn't even exist.

SPEAKER_03 26:44

Yeah, and I think that's a challenging, that's a challenging perspective for people to to deal with and sit with because again, it does affect whoever you're with. Like, y'all really do be having to like I really planned and I was really looking forward to trying to do this, and you gotta designate that money to something else. So you might have to push whatever plan or trip or item you wanted to buy another two to three months because again, it's just but it is challenging to sit with sometimes, but again, it's like for the greater good, it's a us, it's a we. Yeah, this is kind of what we signed up for until again that we work towards or we continue to grind and that come up is here.

SPEAKER_00 27:30

But okay, so how do you remain that or remain having that it's a us mentality when the algorithm is saying, if your man make you mad, go get another one. If your girl make you mad, go to the strip club to get another one.

SPEAKER_01 27:49

Listen, I mean, baby, go ahead. I'm gonna let you go first. Well, what the algorithm tells you.

SPEAKER_03 27:57

To be honest, that ain't my algorithm.

SPEAKER_01 28:00

Man, that's my algorithm is church videos and and cats.

SPEAKER_03 28:10

It's not cats and babies.

SPEAKER_01 28:13

Dogs and babies. Dogs and babies, right? I mean, but you you see a lot of that on that tonight's conversation videos that we have.

SPEAKER_03 28:23

Right.

SPEAKER_00 28:23

So even if it ain't in your algorithm, I've seen them. It's in like the the culture's algorithm, right?

SPEAKER_03 28:30

For sure. Um again, I think like you really have to you can't let other people think for you in situations like that. I think you can get caught up in some stuff if you just take it at face value. Like you really gotta sit there and think about it. Like, what sense does that make? Because at some point, what are you adding to these relationships that's causing them not to work? And if you just keep saying, oh, well, it's him, I'm gonna go find another one. It's him, I'm gonna go find another one. I don't see how that's a solution either. To just jump out of one relationship to another one, and you're thinking it's the other person, and it could really be starting with you. Right. Something at your core that you need to fix and figure out and and improve on, and that'll attract a different, I would say, range of people. Um, so again, I think it is really easy to get caught up in that though, because it's circulating so much and you see it everywhere, right? But you gotta quiet the noise and really sit and think about it, like, yeah, that's not really a solution either.

SPEAKER_00 29:37

Yeah, nah. I um I don't know, for me, sometimes it just be the responses that females give to. It's so for example, this one chick, I asked her, like, this is just a regular question. I'm not trying to like interrogate her or nothing. I was just like, um, what do you bring to the table? You know what I'm saying? She got offended that I said that. And I'm like, Yeah, I just really want to know what qualities do you have as a woman that's gonna, you know, compliment me as a man. Right. And then you act, you could ask the same shit uh questions. It's not like, you know what I'm saying? I'm saying, hey, go work at the warehouse, go, you know what I'm saying? I'm not telling you you gotta go and throw your boots on and go fix the car. I ain't saying all that. I just want to know what quality, right, what will attract a guy to you. I wasn't even trying to talk to her, I just wanted to know what her perspective on it was. She got really offended. Yeah, I was raised different. My granddad told me that I didn't have to. I'm like, what? So you don't have your own mindset because your granddad told you something? Like, yeah, it's just a simple answer that you could have given me. Like, well, I'm a complete woman. Like, you know what I'm saying? I'm in school, I do this, I do that. Like, why do people just feel like they I mean, you don't have to answer, but like, what is that about?

SPEAKER_03 31:10

Like, you could um I think sometimes, again, with that response, I think it's because they don't necessarily have a good answer. Um, they might not know how to answer that. Yeah. And I think again, depending on what their logic is or where they're getting it from, it's one thing to like just know yourself inwardly and have that self-awareness. But it's something when it's like outwardly. So everything is coming from the outside. So it's not really like rooted in anything. Like if you listen into Cardi B, you're getting all of that. Or if you switch it up to somebody else, now you internalizing their logic and what they think and what they believe. So it's like it really shifts, you know, quite frequent, depending on who you're listening to, what you're watching. There's nothing rooted from the inside out. Yeah. So when you ask them that question, of course they're gonna get offended because they're like, Well, what do you mean by that? You know, look at me. Like some people, again, it's all outward. So if they looked apart, they dressed apart, they said they thinking, oh, this is it. But all that is surface, you know, and like you said, if depending on what man you are interacting with, if he's looking for something real, something genuine, that's in that's inner value, internal value, you can't just be, you know, dressing a certain way and that be it. Now, if you're dealing with somebody that's shallow, you got it. You're gonna bag them every time. But if you're dealing with somebody, again, who wants a partner, who wants somebody they can lean on, somebody they can depend on, that's not gonna cut it. That's not gonna cut it.

SPEAKER_01 32:50

Right. Um yeah, and it's it and it's one of those things that well, two things. One is a lot of times people get offended when you you bring that that question up because the things that do actually matter when you talk about what do you bring to the table are the things that that person personally don't care about. Right. If I say, What do you bring to the table, and you like, oh, uh, you get upset, it's because the things that probably do matter, you don't value it yourself. Right. So a lot of times women are like, well, you know, what you bring to the table, then I gotta four, they leave with accomplishments. I gotta, I gotta, you know, I work at this job, I make this much, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I I uh own three businesses, I got two cars, I got a high-rise apartment, I stay on the West. And then lists all these physical accomplishments, detachments, materials. But then if you return, say, well, I I know how to be on time, I'm honest, I communicate, I'm effective, I'm reliable, uh, I'm easy going, I'm soft-spoken. She'd be like, none of that matter, nigga. Like, none of that matters to her. Facts, facts. Because what she told you was, I got this, these material things, this business. And so she looks at it like the things that she values is what she brings to the table. But she can't tell you about her character. Right. She can't tell you that she got trauma and that it's unhealed. She can't tell you that she don't, you know, that she be late for every fucking thing. She can't tell you that she don't she she spends more than she got. She don't, because those are real characteristics that don't matter to her. So if you have them, they don't matter to her. Or excuse is that. Can you meet my material? You match me material for material. Right. Yeah. That's why the table matter conversations get people pissed off. The second thing is that um a lot of times we are people are getting influenced by bullshit. Oh no, they falling for the mirage. That's facts. Yes, that's facts. Like, you got people like Summer Walker or uh uh uh uh what's her name that uh the other chick that sang, not Summerwalker, but the um the the the one song um she had the movie with Kiki Palmer. Uh Scizor. Scissor. Yeah, you got Scissor. No, no, I'm saying both of them. You got Summerwalkie, you got Scissor, you got all these Janae Echo, you got all these all these women who go sing about black niggas and get it, get get your revenge, girl. You got and then they got niggas at home. Yeah. You see them out in public with a dude. Yeah. But I thought that song you were saying, you don't need no dude. I thought in that song you were saying, liberate yourself, ladies. That you got the your powers in the in the cat, in the box. Not that now, but we catch you outside with a dude on a date. Yeah, we see you, uh Rihanna. You went for now, you married. Yeah. Yeah. Grab it to the goodies.

SPEAKER_00 36:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:24

You didn't put the cookies in the jar. I think that's a defense mechanism, though, bro. But that's what I'm saying, is that's what they selling these women. No, that's true. That's true. And they selling it to these women, they sell it to lonely, depressed, single. I need a man, but don't want a man women. And so they these women come out here with that attitude and bravado of Sisza told me, okay, well, Sisza got a man, dumbass. Like, she don't really mean what she's saying. Right. She might be speaking from right. That's no longer where she is. She's singing to where you are. Right. But that's not where you want to be forever. Don't you want a man? So then you gotta, you gotta. That's why when you think about old RB songs, bro, they don't listen to what people say. They was talking about love, like they was like, uh dudes were saying, I'm in love with you, woman. Yeah. Women was like, I can't live without you. Now it's like all the songs is fuck you, no fuck you.

SPEAKER_00 37:28

Like, that's all the songs. I ain't gonna lie though, bro. I've been listening to a lot of RB and I was disgusted because they all talking about infidelity, bro. That's it. Old school though. They talk about But that now, that's when you get in the 70s, 80s. They was. Oh no, I'm talking about Usher. I'm talking about, you know what I'm saying? But that was the turn of the century. I think that was the one. That was the turn of the century, though. And it's like, I could I could do anything your man can't do. I'm listening to all this. I'm like, damn, this talk. I ain't gonna lie, I I started peeping the lyrics when I was going through heartbreak. Was like, that's what you realize. I'm like, damn, I didn't know they were saying this. You feel me? Man, so yeah, it was just crazy, bro. But you are right. Um, all of these artists do send the wrong message. I feel messing. And it's it's it goes a long way, even outside of that, because it's like then you get a lot of rap artists that think like they tell you, like, oh yeah, it's okay to go smoke your neighbor. Oh yeah, it's okay to uh switch up on your brother, it's okay to backdoor your cousin. You know what I'm saying? So it pissed me off because it's like it's really just building more and more chaos within our culture. Even bro, just like I saw all them videos on opening day downtown. Yeah, that was true. Just pure ignorance, bro. Like everybody fighting, just being disrespectful. I'm like, bro, like why we can't never come together, throw a crazy party, and everybody go home unscathed. Like, why can't be we just actually enjoy? They think that's weak or lame to just enjoy each other. Like why we can't just damn bro, uh, nice shoes or whatever. Oh, you know what I'm saying? Whatever.

SPEAKER_01 39:28

Or does everybody want to be seen? Yeah, but and the only way you can be seen is if you the loudest voice in the room or the biggest show in the room. You know what I'm saying? So it's like everybody go downtown and it's like instead of just blending in and enjoying yourself, yeah. I gotta make sure everybody see me. I gotta make sure when they leave people talking about, oh baby dude, that swung on old dude just out of nowhere. Everybody wanna be the the the headline story. Everybody wanna make sure that they leave their lasting impression. That's what social media has cultivated.

SPEAKER_00 40:00

But that's that's it's weird. Yeah, you got you got dudes like Kevin Hart and Kirk Franklin. Them, bro, five feet tall. But they're seen for the positivity that they display, not for the book.

SPEAKER_01 40:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

So it's like everybody wants that viral moment, and it's just like, come on, man. Like, why we can't enjoy. My thing is I always think like, it's so much that I want to do downtown or just anywhere around the city with my kids, but I can't. I can, but it has to be at a certain time. You gotta literally get out there super early, right? And then leave super early. You damn near gotta be in and out when the birds stop chirping, leave.

SPEAKER_01 40:49

Like you gotta literally be out of there before before sunfall, which is sad, but it's like that's the the society that we live in, and yeah, that's what people think is the most important thing, you know what I'm saying? And unfortunately, people don't have the common decency to understand that you're not the only person experiencing the moment, right? Like, if I'm downtown at open a day, I recognize I'm not the only one down here, right? So my experience is though it feels personal, it's really collective. Because if the crowd is all walking this way, I'm not just walking by myself, I'm walking in a crowd of people. I'm in a collective moment of something, but people don't see that. They don't they feel their their experiences only unto themselves. So if I just get to shooting my gun off, who got hurt? Right. The 50 people around you that's who just got hurt. Oh, they did? Oh, damn. They don't think past the moment, the consequences of that. So it's crazy, bro. It's definitely crazy, which is why, again, for my birthday, I was in the crib. Went to the movies with my with my wife and kid and went home. That's what's up. Like, it's like I don't be outside for what? I go, we go to restaurants, like, even I was just telling somebody this earlier on the phone. Like, I'm at that place now. I want to go to that uh hidden bar, jazz bar underneath a hotel that don't nobody know about. That's full of white and other people that's paying$60 a plate. I wanna go there. Cause there ain't no shootings and bullshit happening there. Man, facts. I don't want to go to opening day. I'm gonna go to the Tigers game on uh fucking August 12th when they play in the Mariners that don't nobody wanna go to that game. That's when I'm going down to see the Tigers play. I don't need to be a part of every moment that's happening in the city because that's where I know people gonna be on bullshit. I'm gonna go to the Tigers game when ain't nobody going. I'm gonna go to the Lions game and the Pistons game when there ain't nobody going. I'm gonna go downtown when there ain't nobody. Like I that's when I wanna go when there is no trap. I don't need to be around people no more. Yeah. I don't I put me on another planet. I'm on another planet right now. Got to gotta see. Because I live amongst only myself and my people. Gotta be. I don't even see other people. Gotta be. I go to Girl Strong, I don't even see people. I just get in there, get out. I I move with such a like, I don't need none of you niggas. Man. Because it's just like you go out here and you get too involved in it, bro, and that's you you just see too much bull. Like everybody was on social media putting the whole what's on Sat Mile and Grash shit. Man. I'm like, what is everybody saying this for? Then I finally see the video of my man's pressuring old dude. Yeah. In the bathroom. What's on to the monograss? And dude, nervous and scared. He browning. And he just knocked dude out in the bathroom. I'm like, and y'all turned that into a viral post? Yeah, not everybody posting and laughing. What's on to the monograss? You're like, bro, a dude got his head clocked off for that. Man. I lived in Detroit all my life. I don't even know what's on fucking Seven Mile and Crash. Man. I drove past it to work plenty of times, and I'm like, even when my man said it, I was like, bro, I would have gotten knocked out. Because I wouldn't even know. And I'm sitting there like, think it's a McDonald's over there? You know what I'm saying? Like, I don't know. I think it's a strip mall or something. Like, I had to look it up on Google. Like, show me the street. Just in case. Just in case I need to know. Like, but it's like, but that, but it, and so when we talk about like our marriage, it's like, bro, we we we are living our marriage in a way that's like what works for us in our household. Yeah. We ain't gotta be a part of everything that's going on out here. We find our own ways as a family to go out and have fun, whether it's simple, whether it's extravagant, whether it's whatever. But knowing the world out there is like, bro, we not trying to listen to that stuff. We more so listen to it to talk about it in a sense of like, like you asking us, what is our perspective so that we can learn more about each other? Right, right. I'm like, hey, let's watch this video with these people debating 50-50 so I can learn more about why how you think. But not because we actually care about the 50. We're we're gonna be like, maybe we should change our model. Right. No, we more so do it to try to figure out like how do we feel about society and things that's happening out there because these are the things that we also use to try to figure out what we gonna teach our kids. Right. So I'm like, well, I didn't know you think like that, bae. Okay, this is how I feel. Now we have a better understanding of each other so that when it comes to raising our daughter, are we on the same page about the same topics? Am I teaching her that a relationship is 100-100 and you teaching her 50-50? That's why we watch it so we can know where we where the lines don't always cross at. You know what I'm saying? But other people use it as uh great argumentative things that leave them single for another year. Uh facts. Facts.

SPEAKER_00 46:29

Um Damn, when was I at? We could fin again on this. No cat. No cat. Oh, that's where I was gonna ask because you you have spoken on the fact of like being in that moment. Yeah. Um, this a little, I'm I'm gonna walk a little bit away from that, but it's still kind of you know the same. Have you ever struggled with living in the moment? And if so, how did you tackle that?

SPEAKER_01 46:59

Um I think I have struggled with living in the moment sometimes. Um I think because you get so life has a funny way of just like weighing on you. Right. It's kind of like somebody leaning on you, you know what I'm saying? And it's just like at first it don't really bother you.

SPEAKER_03 47:21

Gradual.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

And then as time, as they lay on you longer and longer, you kind of be like, ah, god damn, I move. Like, yeah, your knee fall asleep. You know what I'm saying? Like, and so life is like that, man. And so when it really gets weighing on you, you you kind of tend to stop appreciating the small things or not living in the moment. Again, hence why I was talking about my birthday. It was like, I just want to be present right in the moment, you know what I'm saying, and be like, man, I'm with my family and we having a good time. So it's like those things, man, you don't, it's hard to kind of do when when life is heavy. Because you're so focused on everything else, everything else has your attention, and it makes you feel like, ah, okay, that stuff can wait because I got all this to worry about. When really it's like, bro, live in the moment and appreciate all this stuff. Like, right. When we all go die, these bills still gonna keep coming. She goes, my daughter's gonna have bills, and we gonna be long gone. Like, yeah, houses is gonna be houses, cars gonna be cars, they're gonna keep breaking down, people gonna have to buy a new one. These systems never stop repeating themselves. So the thing that I have to focus on is something that doesn't repeat, and that's life. You know what I'm saying? And so I've learned to just kind of change my thinking and change the way that I see stuff and stop being so consumed with systems and being more focused on the one thing that I know I don't get back, it doesn't repeat, it doesn't rewind, it only goes forward, and it goes forward at a at a crazy rate, and that's life. So it's like, man, let me just live it, let me just enjoy it, let me embrace it, let me open my eyes, look around, and embrace like, oh man, this is my home, this is my couch, like let me embrace these things, and not just look at them like okay, I can get a new one. I just need a new one, I just need a new one, I just need a new one, right? And and realize just like I'm grateful to even have. Like, when you really start looking at other third world countries, you start living, looking at like what they sit on, how they live, like you think about living in like somewhere like Iran right now, all the stuff going on over there. They live in the desert, bro. Yeah, when the wind blows on my block, I gotta just worry about trash when I'm coming down the street. Right. They live where sand is kicking up in your face every day. When it bro, I could hate, I would hate that, bro. Yeah, but I don't have to live with that struggle, right? But I don't think about that. When it's windy outside, I could just be like, man, it's cold, or I could think like, man, better better to be cold and it's windy, then had a sandstorm kicking in my face, and I'm covering up with a mask and all this just to breathe. Like, it's certain things you just think like, bro. I if I if I had to be in somebody else's shoes, how easily I would learn to appreciate the small stuff that I just wake up and be like, oh god, this again. Yeah. Where it's like, bro, they over there getting, you know, not to be all super political because I'm not, but like they over there getting, we bombing them. Yeah, we ain't even felt that yet over here. Yeah. Like, you know what I'm saying? They ain't even took that time to do that back to us to where we like we bombing people like sleeping through bombings, people waking up having to move because they home that got blown up, or a building next to their home that got blown up, and they living in fear, like we still chilling over here for now. Like, right, right. You get what I'm saying? So it's like I just kind of like living in the moment has come to understanding, like, it could always be worse, and where I am at is probably still higher on the totem pole than a lot of other people, and I could just kind of rest on that. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 51:06

So, so how but like how do you I don't know if you dealt with it, but it's like I'll I'll give you an example. Like, years ago, I would be going through so much turmoil that when you know, like you look at your check and you like, damn, I gotta pay this, this, and that. Well, that check ain't mine. Yeah, I had to look like two years later, like I couldn't live in two years. I'm like, I gotta live, it's 2016, I gotta wait till 2018 to start, you know, tapping into what's going on. Yeah, yeah. And it's like, how do you get there? Because I ain't gonna lie. Uh, with me, it was the fact that I would just continuously listen to motivationals. I didn't even believe what they were saying at first. I had to keep listening until I did believe what they were saying. For sure. Because what I was used to is, as y'all know, it's every month damn near some crazy shit happen. Right, right, right. Every month, it's like, I don't know when it's gonna happen, but it happened. So now I'm at a peaceful mind state because I've done the work to when it when something does come out of the blue, it's like, damn, another one. I'm gonna take care of it, but damn, it's another one. Back then it wasn't like that. It'll just be like, fuck.

SPEAKER_01 52:29

It's like you said though, like, when you talk about like, oh, this check ain't mine, on to the next one. It's like living in a moment for me, it's like every time we get paid, I always say, let's go out the eating. Yeah. Because we we might have to do hot dog water for the next two weeks. Yeah. But at least for once, let's let's just sit down and have a real solid ass meal as a family. No, that's what's up. And let's just pay for it, let's not sit there and worry about how big it'd be under$20, none of that. Get what you want, we're going to eat at least once like King. Yeah. And then if we gotta be struggling slaves that we're gonna be struggling, say, Yeah. But let's not always, but let's not just go straight to like spend all the money on the bills. And now we just struggling, like, bro, no, before we eat, let's at least sit down, enjoy a solid meal, feel good about what we eat, and feel good about being out, feel good about existing, like everything's okay. And then let's go home and try to worry and be in spirit of all these damn bills that we got. But for this moment, while we out eating, we gonna enjoy this like we ain't gotta worry about nothing else. I got you. You know what I'm saying? And we that's something we do now. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Or or we go take rides late at night just to get out the house because being in your house so much, you be stressed. You looking at stuff you gotta pay for. Everything gotta get paid. The walls, you like repaying them, that's$150. Like, so it's like, bro, let's just get outside and just let's get let's ride and get some air. Let's just, you know what I'm saying? Like, it's just small things, right? Small little practices of like gratefulness or small little practices of difference. You know what I'm saying? Um my homeboy always says the curse of comparison. You know what I'm saying? He always wanted to write this book called The Curse of Comparison. That that just that little phrase, the curse of comparison, man, is what keeps that depression loop going. And the moment you break it and just realize like what I have is what I have, what I will get is what I will get, and you leave it at that. I think that's that that's worked for me.

SPEAKER_03 54:46

I don't know about I would say I wasn't there initially. I think it took it took a minute for me to even adapt that practice. But I think like for me, I was always like on to the next, on to the next, on to the next. So that's what was keeping me from being present and being grounded and being rooted. It was like, okay, checklist, checklist, goal, goal. Yeah, and you just miss out on so much time and so much life when you go day to day like that.

SPEAKER_01 55:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:20

Um, so then it's like you get home and you just you still feel unfulfilled, even though you accomplished a lot. Right. You still like miss the opportunity. So, no, once I again decided, okay, I need to slow down to be more present. Or if I don't do everything on my to-do list, today is still a good day. Like I'm still, I still have value and worth within myself because just because I didn't accomplish all these things, that doesn't take away from who I am as a person overall. Right. And then, like you said, even though I don't have all the things like I would hope or I know it would help, I still have what I have is still good enough. Like I'm still, I still can move around, I still can walk. It's people out here that can't walk. There's people out here that truly have to depend on somebody else to take them to and fro. There's people out here, like again, it's just like you said, there's always a way to look at the glass being half full versus half empty. You just have to be intentional about what perspective you're gonna put energy towards.

SPEAKER_01 56:31

Come on, huh?

SPEAKER_03 56:32

Um, because I was again just mentally draining myself, emotionally draining myself. Yeah, and then that started manifesting in me just being physically tired all the time.

SPEAKER_01 56:42

Right.

SPEAKER_03 56:42

So even though I had all these things I wanted to do, like you said, you just get in that state of depression, like ah, I don't even feel like doing it now. Because if I gotta do that, then I gotta do this, and you start getting this like loop in your mind of if I gotta do that, then I gotta do this.

SPEAKER_02 56:58

Right.

SPEAKER_03 56:59

And I don't have this to do that, so I can't do that. And it again, it just blinds you from being able to see what you can do. Right. Though it's a tiny step in the right direction of where you're trying to go to accomplish what you want, right? It's still a step nonetheless. Right. Um, so it's just again, just being mindful and choosing to look at the day like that every day. Um, it's I would say how I got through those moments.

SPEAKER_00 57:28

So uh you spoke on like how it could bring on depression and stuff like that. So um, do you know like or have you ever heard of depersonalization? So I thought I was depressed years ago, right? But it was more so I heard this term. I can't even remember where I first heard it from, but I looked it up and I'm gonna actually give the definition right now. Because this is exactly what I was going through. It was like being disassociated. It's like a disassociate, disassociated condition.

SPEAKER_03 58:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 58:10

And basically, it's like you feeling a detachment from your body, thoughts, and emotions. And it's like, damn, it's like, so what's the difference between that and depression? And so I would feel as if like depression to me, it was more so that I was just down all the time. Okay. But the depersonalization side of it, that kicked in when my pops died. Because I felt like I wasn't even on this planet for real. I was here, but I wasn't here. Right. Like it was, it was days like I would have to. Uh, this retail store I worked for, they had a hotline you could call. If you was just mentally instable, and my shift was 4 a.m. to 1 p.m. Every single day I clocked in, I had to go call that hotline because of my emotions was everywhere. Yeah. And nobody really knew what I was battling. I'd be on the phone crying like a motherfucker. Like, right. And I'm just like, I woke up feeling good, but on my way to work, it's like the emotions just pouring and pouring and pouring. So I was like in this shell of myself, and the only thing other people could see is like you being weird or you acting weirdish and shit like that. But I'm like, Right. You right, like y'all don't know the story, y'all don't know what got me to this point. Y'all don't know. It's it's a lot that led up to this, even before that. You know what I'm saying? Exactly. So and so yeah, uh, it was just I will have these moments, and I'll be cool for the most part. Like, I don't know, just in the morning, I'll be getting ready, I'll be, I'll be feeling good, rejuvenated, everything. Then soon as I get to work, it's like a rush of emotions. And I'm like, damn, I really can't. I don't know if I can make it through this shit for real. It's fine in the morning. Um I'm already, you know what I'm saying, tripping. I I don't really know what the this is an unfamiliar territory for me. Like I I dealt with depression, which I know how that feels, but this is something different. This I damn near feel like I'm dying. Like on some real shit. I feel like I'm dying in the moment. Right. And I would just be stalking or I'll be walking to the bathroom. And it's like uh uh crazy, just crazy emotions everywhere. Right. So I never known nobody else that could tell me anything about it, uh, other than you know what they think. Like, wait, is it the depression you're talking about? I'm like, no, it's the personalization. It's like just feeling, I'm just feeling detached from everybody. I don't have any attachments to nobody, family, friends, whoever. I'm at work, people just like thinking I'm just happy as hell because I'm always joking and whatever. Woo, ooh, ooh. Right. But I'm like at the same time, y'all don't even know the battles, you know what I'm saying? So uh have either one of y'all ever dealt with something similar, or have y'all, like I say, have y'all ever heard of it? Or you know? I have.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:36

I know I did, I know I did it at at um this one same retail place. I but you know what I'm saying? I I definitely there are a lot of times, man, when like I would just zone out because I was so sad. Yeah. Like I would just be working, and then I'm just like, it's almost like I would catch myself realizing like, dang, I'm unhappy right now. Like, and I'm just like, like even driving there to work, I would automatically feel the shift. Yeah. Like I I could feel myself slowly kind of just like, like you almost say, like you say you're dying, it's like I could feel the I and I used to call it depression, but I could feel the shift in my mood where I was just like, oh, like now I don't want to go to work. It's I'm I'm no longer happy now. Like I'm literally forcing myself to get through this, like, right. I'm again, same way. I'm go, I'm gonna look on the outside at work like hey, mm-hmm, but uh, you know what I'm saying? But I'm literally doing that because if I don't, yeah, then I might just I might just shut down. Yeah, I might literally just sit down and just sit on this ground and not do anything else. Yeah, and I obviously I'll go somebody walk by, fire, hey, you gotta get up, get fired, whatever. But I'm saying, like my mind is going to just tell me we're we're done. Right. And I'm just gonna sit because again, I would go to the stalls in the bathroom and just sit there and hold my head and my hands, like, like I can't keep doing this. Yeah, I feel like I'm fighting a force or I'm fighting against my own self. Like, I don't want to be here, I don't want to do this, I don't know what I want to do, but it's not this, and this is actually like pulling for me. It's not the money's not worth it. There's nothing that can change me from how I'm feeling. I just need to I want to get up out of here. I used to want to leave work every day, Max. I swear to god, before you even get there, before I even get there. Before I and by the time I walk in, I'm literally what door sliding at the front, and I'm like, turn around, turn around, turn around, turn around. And I, but then there's a thing, there's a thousand things that's like, no, we gotta pay this, you need money for this. But everything in my soul is like, don't do this again, and then I I gotta hit the switch that turns off my brain, and now I'm just uh but I the whole time I'm like, bro, I I would walk right out this bit. Like, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, right walk right out this bit, and just like every day was just f it. You know what I'm saying? So it's it's that disassociation where you really kind of feel like you like you unplugged and you kind of just like you know, life support, yeah. And you just until you can plug yourself back up again. Like, yeah, it was it was rough, it was rough, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:36

That's it's so crazy because it's like that was one moment that I felt like I was detached from the matrix, but in a bad way though, yes, like yeah, I don't want to be on in the same mindset as everybody else, or you know what I'm saying, operating in the same energy as everybody else, but not under these circumstances though, right? Right, like this ain't you know what I'm saying? I'm like it was a time where during that time I used to smoke a lot, like chimney, you know what I'm saying? I would come to work and then I just was already over it. I'd go sit in the car and smoke for two hours. Man, on the cloud. I'm on the cloud.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:21

I did like before I started working at such location. I didn't even smoke. Yeah, at such location. At such location. You know what I'm saying? Go ahead. Protecting the integrity of the podcast. Okay, but I didn't even smoke when I started working there. Yeah, I had given it up like some years before. Right. And boy, man, it it took it didn't take a month. It didn't take a month. It was like, bro, you once you just because at that point it was like now I'm just looking forward to that. Yeah. Because that's the only time I'm probably gonna feel something if is if I hit this. Like, no cat. Because once I go back in, oh my god, dude, I'm not even I don't even feel like I'm there. Yeah, hey, I'm on autopilot. I'm literally just I feel like I'm floating through that boy. Yeah. Just doing stuff. Like, yeah. My brain was only clicking for like, oh, lunch, you know what I'm saying? Break. Like yeah. Other than that, once I'm back on, it's like float. Like I was a zombie, bro. And it was it was like you say, a chimney, bro.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:34

It was oh boy. It was so bro, it was so crazy. I looked up, I was in like seven different smoke groups. I used to go outside with like five people one time. Yes. And it's like none of us actually, like none of the groups actually hung together. Oh, except for we smoked. I would no, I'm saying like each seven groups was like that own group. I was the it was like maybe me and maybe one other person that was common participants in every group. In every group, I feel you. But like never did these groups, some people didn't even like each other. Yeah. But I would just be the one mainly that's everywhere. Like, I'm just like, you know what? They're like, you about to go out and smoke? I'm like, I wasn't, but shit, might as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:20

I would be getting ready to, I'd be done smoking. Getting ready to go back in and see somebody coming out to smoke and be like, I'll stay with them one more time. Just to keep smoking. Because I don't want to go back in there.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:32

Man, facts.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:34

Knowing I'm late. Knowing I'm late, but I'm like, I'd rather sit out here with you. And ask you, like, how's it in there? They like, oh, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:47

That was just, it was like, bro, for me, it was just, I felt like Eeyore. I felt like Eeyore. Every day it was like, on my way to said job. Bro. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:59

Like, bro, let me go ahead and clock in. There was a period where like she would have to get me dressed in the morning. Because I'd be so defeated, bro. Man. I'd be so depleted, like, of energy, of life. Like, I'm just like, bro, I don't even want to get this bed. I'm good. She'd have to like give me dress arms up. Man. Link. Link. Like. Because if she don't, bro, I'm not putting these clothes on. I'm not doing it, bro. I don't want to go. I I it was. I would, bro, I I would have a so what I what I would smoke comes in a pack of 12, bro. I'd I'd be six in on the way to work. Man. And then have to make the other six stretch through work. Man. Get off, get another pack so I can smoke six on the way home. Like, bro, it was like I'm going through these because, bro, it's like I my my actual nervous system cannot handle the level of disassociation I'm facing. Yeah. It's so much disassociation. I'm like, I'm I'm I'm uh I'm overloading. You know what I'm saying? And she she seen me go through that on multiple stints at such location that I went multiple times. Like she's seen like just like how bad. And again, you know, thank God for having a partner who sees and tries to encourage and nurture and nourish and support. But it's like, man, or even understand, but it's like, man, the level in which I I think again, like you say, only certain people can really understand that out-of-body experience. Experience of like, bro, I'm not, I'm not well. Right. But I gotta do this. And I gotta keep doing this until something or someone tells me I don't have to. But as long as I gotta do it, I am as numb as dry pickles. Like, I don't know, there's the there's nothing. I'm just you know what I'm saying? Like, I just there's nothing there, bro.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:17

Like, it and I feel you, bro. It's it's so crazy. And I I promise you, I'm I got but it's like this this is one of them ones that it was just like for me, in the moment, having your kids run up on you with joy, and you not joyous, anybody don't have. I mean, but for me it was like I really don't care who else ran up happy. Because anybody else ran up happy, they had their handout one a dollar or something, you know what I'm saying? But the kids, they just want that time. Like, that's it. My daughter, like, dad, can I jump on your back? Can you run around the house? I don't really feel like running around the house. I gotta do it because you my daughter and I love you. I ain't so I'm not telling her this, I'm thinking this. Oh, for sure. Like, yeah, you my daughter and I love you. So of course I'm gonna do it, but you still disassociating in that moment. Exactly. I damn near feel like going in the corner somewhere and being depressed. That's and that's what's so fucked up when in those moments, yeah, your coping mechanism is just going in the corner and being depressed. Right. It's like it's not even a real let me go find joy. It's like let me go find a safe space to be depressed in the corner by myself. Yeah, a place where I can go shut down.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:43

Right. Because you don't, you you can't, you cannot, you can't function. You're it's like you're out of gas. Yeah. And and eventually you like, I need to just I can't even begin to try to find the joy or do any work until I take a season to just wallow in this depression. I have to actually go through the depression. I can't skip it just because I know that it's there, right? I actually gotta go through it. So I need a season of like, I need to be the worst version of myself, the saddest version of myself, whatever. Then I can come out of it and try to recorrect, redirect, whatever. But how often do you get that? Right? How many days do you get? How many you can only, it's only so much time before somebody needs you. Your kids need you to this. You gotta go drop somebody off here, you gotta go pick up somebody, you gotta go get food, you gotta go get dinner, you gotta drop somebody off at school, you gotta go do this. This needs fixing. The the bill gotta do it. You don't, your brain does not get a chance to even stop because other people are still demanding you be Superman. That's why I say on that one song, who saves Superman when he needs saving? Facts. Because he still gotta save. Like, Superman getting his ass whooped. Man, and he's still like, oh, that building's about to crush that dog. You are bleeding, Superman. You are weak, and he's still like, but I gotta go save that dog from being crushed by the building. I still gotta stop these people from getting hit by the bus. I still got bro, you are wounded, but what but no one is allowing you the space or time to be broken. You just have to learn how to manage being broken while being well, right? Or have it to function as if you're well, but you're broke, broken and healed at the same time, and you're need it, but you're neither completely, right? You know what I'm saying? So I I I get it, man. I get it, and that's why I say it's like dope to have a partner who saw that and as best as she could.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:54

I was gonna say, because I did I was not perfect in that, but I I was still willing to again learn what was going on and try to support the best I could. Right. Even for you. It's like how do how do you explain this?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:09

Yeah, how I mean, yeah. That's even that's even how do I how do I even tell my partner I I I'm stuck, I can't do this. I need days. Right. I want I I'm on the verge of giving up on life, and I need to literally shut down for I don't know how long. I don't even know how long it's gonna take me to reboot. I just know I need to shut down though. Like I can't keep going. But then how do I say that knowing that my role that I play in this family function is important? I can't shut down. And and not only can I not shut down, she does not have the means to fulfill the things that I do. So she's like, so who's gonna do it if you can't? Keep going. You know what I'm saying? Like you gotta keep going. And and and and so again, and and sometimes I talk about like men don't get that, like women. Women can they can lose a parent, a sibling, a dog, and and be willing to be broken. And and men have to, you know, we gotta coddle that. Oh baby, sorry. She calling on emotional distress, like men don't we don't get that. I I tell I tell my woman, like, I need a month off from bills and talking and solving problems. She like, nice, but uh I give you a day. You know what I'm saying? Like, you could lose a parent and and it's like you only bro, you only get a week. You can be down in the slumps like that, but you can be down in the slumps in your drawers, you ain't washed up for a week. You lost your your parent, your your mom, your dad, you get a week of being able to be just completely broke. Nah, after that week is up, right? Can you can as a man, can I get you to get back to and it's like, damn, what if I'm not ready? What if my mind's not ready? How do we, how do I not go into that disassociating sinking place? You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 1:16:20

That, that, that, so uh, Paris, have you dealt with it or are you like familiar with, you know, that vibe or energy?

SPEAKER_03 1:16:32

I'd I'd say I'd I've had versions of it, but I don't know if it was to that extent. Like, I remember um like having some stuff going on health-wise, and then just had this level of health anxiety. Yeah. Where like I was just thinking the worst was about to happen every day, all day. Like, it didn't matter. I'm like, I got where's the nearest hospital? Like, everywhere I went, it was just on my mind, like, where's the nearest hospital? Because I didn't want that what happened to happen again or not be like somewhere I could go to get up. Yeah. Because it was just a traumatic experience that I had. And then another instance was like again similar. Where I was working at the time, it just made me really paranoid because they kept trying to like say I wasn't doing my job or they were trying to demote me, and it just felt like it didn't matter what I was doing. Man, I wasn't doing nothing right. And at the same time, I'm like, well, I can't just quit because I need this for my family, and you know, I got this toddler that I gotta help support and all that type of stuff. So again, it was just like you said, I'm literally finding things to do to help me make it through the day or make it through the shift.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:55

Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:56

So, like I would um, I don't know, like just little stuff. So I'm scrolling on like social media to kind of help find some type of motivation to make it through the next few hours. Or like he said, you trying to make it from break to lunch to your break, but versus you like actually enjoying it, you're trying to get some type of stimulant to help you make it through the rest of the shift. Or like I remember a lot of the other jobs I had, I would just tough it through, but this one in particular, I literally would call off because I just mentally could not bring myself to get up and go. I'm like, today is just one of them days I can't do it. Yeah, I'm calling in, I need a mental day, as they would say, because it just got really bad.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:45

Yeah. It's and it's so crazy because that's just it seems like when you go through any of these type of issues, it seemed like the world then flicks this switch where they don't understand human problems or emotions, or you might just just regular day-to-day life. Yeah, it's like that you could tell them, like, yeah, somebody died of my like, for example, with me. I told y'all this story before. When my pops, they told me he had uh, was it less than six weeks to live or something like that? And then the store I was working at, they said, Well, yeah, can you uh give us 10 more minutes? And I'm like, what the fuck, what is 10 more minutes gonna do besides somebody me off in the moment? Right. Or you know what I'm saying, just I might pass out. You know what I'm saying? You never know what might happen because of the news that I just got. Right. And it's like, well, we need you to do this.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:53

And it's like it's the lack of consideration, and then it's almost like some people be like, well, until they're actually in the situation, it's like they don't understand it. Right. They can't give compassion for it, or they're making it seem like, oh, well, it can't be that bad. No, it can be. Right. Just be thankful it's not you in the situation. You know what I'm saying? But that's it's it's just crazy. Like, again, when I had like the traumatic experience where I ended up having to go to the hospital via ambulance, like it was other people that was like whispered, like, well, she's never here. You don't know I'm in the hospital. Like, again, it's just you over here thinking I'm like not trying to do again, not trying to do her job. She's not showing up. Yeah, but you don't understand, like, there's something more serious going on than me just not showing up to work. Right. Like, I want to be there, but it's just I have like you said, I have other things going on. You asking me, can I say another? No, I can't say another thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:53

Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:54

I gotta go.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:56

It's it's ridiculous, it's ridiculous. But it's at this point, I just learned one one thing that gave me a sense of peace, honestly, is just understanding that people gonna be people. So that's in every aspect of life for me. Like, I even have conversations with my girl to get her to understand, like, of course, we in a very happy relationship, you know, but I let her know, like, if you was to go away from the program, which the program is our unity, if you was to go against the program, I might be messed up about it, but I don't think I'd be like bamboozled. You know what I'm saying? Because I just I'm at a place in life where I'm like, I almost expect everybody to turn. I mean, I don't, I'm not waiting on it, but I've I just study human behavior where people wanna they want the next big thing. They want what's shining over there until you walk up and see really it was just the sun beaming off broken glass. Basically. Like, so you dropped a whole masterpiece to go chase that broken glass, and you didn't understand what it was until you got up close on it.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:22

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:23

So, yeah, it's just situations like that and just me not putting my all into other people, putting more, investing more into myself. Right, right, right. That's what even made me start to pie. Because I'm like, I've been for years. Vince, no, I mean you know what I'm saying, we done talked about this. You know, we done talked about this time and time and time again. But no matter what somebody tell you, something gotta click in your own mind. For sure. Like for me, I just got tired of being tired. You know what I'm saying? Like, I got tired of saying that I'ma start it. I got tired of saying, yeah, bro, I'ma start for real next. I'm gonna start for real this next time. We gonna, we gonna, we gonna cook, bro. We didn't had too many conversations, and I'm just like, it's too easy to wake up and be basic. It's too easy to, I could fall in line with everybody else just waking up and just being there. Right? And I just got to that point where I'm like, I'm tired of being. I grew up around so many people that's alive that's not living. They're living dead lives. Just waking up and doing nothing. They don't have no true ambition. Um if they talk about something that's what it was, it's a has been situation. It's like, yeah, 30 years ago I had it all. I had woo wah wob. I did this. Okay, yeah, but what you got today? And I ain't even talking about just materialistic stuff. I'm talking about like morals and values. And what do you stand on? What what what values do you hold, you know, for you and your family? Like, what's important to you? I I don't even argue with people no more. It's like I realize if you arguing about common sense stuff, I'm not even talking to you no more. Like, if you want to argue with me about my peace of mind, you want to argue with me about my opinion, like you can't tell somebody their opinion is wrong for the most part. Now, if the person comes telling you it's a fact, that's different. But because I feel a way or this is how I live, don't then try to bum rush me with your logic on how you think I should live. Because what might what might work for you and your household might not work for me.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:55

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:56

And vice versa. I can't come tell you, well, live your life like this. It's not gonna always work for the next person. So but yeah, it's it's it's it's a lot of um, it's a lot of people that just to me they don't have no common sense. Like common sense not even common at all. I learned that. I I literally learned that from just life's experiences where I would just be listening. I might not even ask the question, I might just sit and listen to two other people talk.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:31

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:32

And I'm like, damn, they dumber than I thought. Like, I really thought you were intelligent, and I wanted to ask you something, but because I see how you operate, or if I see you not in control of your emotions, I can't deal with you. I talked, my daughter, she only five. I talk to her all the time. I'm like, hey, don't, and it's crazy. We just had this conversation earlier. Uh I'm like, stop crying and doing all this extra stuff because you're not getting your way. In life, you're not gonna always get your way. And we outside, she says, Can you play basketball with me? I say, yeah, we're about to play basketball. She's like, Alright, I want to go in the backyard. I'm like, okay, we go in the backyard. Alright, I'm taking my coat and my shoes off. I'm about to get on the trampoline. No, you're not. Now you wanna boo-hoo and cry because I won't allow you to get pneumonia. Like, so what's really going on? I'm like, you want to act like a baby? Go in the house and do what babies do, go to sleep. We not all that hollering or crying and balling your face up like old homework. We not going for that. I'm not playing around. So, right, you know what I'm saying? Either get your attitude right or go sit on somewhere. Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:59

But you know, because again, like you you feel what you feel, but you're gonna feel it over there. Right. And once you sort through it, we can regroup and we can have a discussion, we can talk about it. But same thing with, you know, Kobe. I'll be like, girl, you got big feelings, go have it in your room. Right. And once you come down where we can talk, let's talk about it. But again, like you said, as your parent, yeah, I have to look out for you in ways that you're not able to comprehend yet. I know it don't make sense to you now. But okay, go on, go on, have, go, go on there and sort your feelings. Because again, I'm not gonna tell you, oh, you shouldn't feel because I've experienced that too. Right. You shouldn't feel that way because I do this, that, that, and the other. You didn't ask to be here. Me and your daddy brought you here. So again, feel how you feel. Fit in your room and sort through it. Nah, for real. And then once you come down to something that's logical, we we can talk it through. So you can understand like what's going on. Right. Wise to know. But you know, we could talk about it now.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:11

So what what is speaking on parenting? What is the biggest thing that y'all learned about yourself since Kobe been born?

SPEAKER_03 1:28:23

You gonna have me start this one? Let me think. I gotta think on that because it was quite a bit of things that I learned that I was like just overlooking.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:38

Well, you can go for all of them. I mean not the floor and the ceiling.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:46

Let me think, let me think, let me think. Um it didn't come natural to me. I'll start with that. Like parenting did not come natural to me. I realized that again, I my indecisiveness, how I was not direct. Like, I was just like, ooh, this is work. This is work. Especially like, okay, newborn, okay. I'm just basically keeping her alive. Then when she was like taller, now she's trying to talk and she's like mimicking behavior and trying to implement structure. I'm like, I am not good at this. I'm not. So I'm like, I don't have no structure, I'm not direct, I'm not good at disciplining because it was like an emotional thing for me. So I'm like, I don't want her to cry, I don't want her to feel bad. I'm in my head, like, am I causing emotional trauma? And again, a lot of it was just because I had unresolved trauma with my parent. So I'm sitting here just in my head, like, I don't want to put this on her. What was put on me? I need to deal with this. Like, I need to deal with it. So I would say that's the biggest thing that got revealed to me, uh, parenting with Kobe. Even then, it's just like some of my my parents' habits. I started to see those the older she got, and how I would talk to her, how I would discipline her, and I'm like, okay, I'm basically like shaming her and guilting her. She doesn't understand, right? But she's gonna feel that. Right. So I'm like, I need to redirect how I the words I use, because even then it's like my parent, in a way, would manipulate me not to do stuff that they didn't want me to do, even though it wasn't necessarily bad. It's just they didn't feel like they wanted me to do it. Yeah, so they would kind of talk in a manipulative way, and I caught myself like doing that to her early on. I'm like, no, I want her to be confident in her decision making, I don't want her to second guess herself. Right. So I have to do the work to figure out again how to talk to her. So I'm not making her feel like or guilting her to do what I want her to do. But I want her to be self-aware, to be like, okay, well, I don't want to do that, I want to do this, be confident then in doing that.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:14

Type thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:16

You know what helped me with that? Um the movie Pursuit of Happiness. So when Will Smith basically told his son, like, uh, you know, you probably don't want to focus on playing basketball because there's so many other kids that's doing this, that's gonna be better than you. And then he doubled back and told him, like, don't never let nobody tell you that you can't do something, including me. People will project what they can't do onto you. So I took that and I started, you know, instilling that in my kids.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:50

It pisses me off when they tell me they can't do something. I'm like, you you just ain't tried, or you haven't tried enough, because you can actually do pretty much anything for real. So with me, I just tell my kids all the time, like, just do your best.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:08

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:09

As long as you do your best, I took that, they'll be quick to be like, Dad, when I get on, I'ma buy you this, this, and that, and that, and that. I'm like, look, do for yourself.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:19

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:20

That's you doing for yourself is gonna make me feel better than anything. Yeah. So of course, don't leave me high and dry. Right. But focus on building you. Cause just like it's a lot of people that's not born in poverty situations, poverty-stricken situations, to where they don't worry about buying their parents houses and cars and stuff when they get their millions. They focus on doing for them, for themselves. You know what I'm saying? So I'm like, I want my kids to know like you don't owe me nothing but to do right by yourself. That's what's gonna let me know I did a great job at raising you. You come out with the right morals and values, and you ain't just chasing that shiny broken glass over there. You know what I'm saying? Like, you actually living for something, like, and I tell them, well, my sons for the most part, I'm gonna stop telling y'all to not do something, right? I'm gonna just let you know the consequences. So if you decide that you want to go certain routes, just understand. Either you're gonna choose your family or you're gonna choose the pavement. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's it's no in-between with me. I'm not sticking around to hear excuses, you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm like, I do a lot to just be involved, even when I had nothing but myself. Like, I had got fired when they was first born, everything. And I took jobs I would never take. People know I I despise fast food. I don't even eat fast food, nothing. Like, I took a job at Popeye's for two weeks only because my son's birthday was covered up. The disgust of the mashed potatoes splashing up against my shoes every night. I'm getting more and more detached from life. One more mashed potato bow hit my shoe, it's over with. I wanna see another mashed potato.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:41

Look, dude over there swimming in mashed potatoes.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:46

Man, they got chicken falling off the little tenderizer. They telling me, no, you gotta cook that. I'm like, I wouldn't dare. And this spot used to be my favorite chicken spot. And I was like, when I found out that's what they was doing, I say, yo, I'm good. Like, I can't do it no more. Like it's just insane. But I did I did so much. I took so it was so many sacrifices that I made for my kids. I had this is um my son's mama, she bought me an Xbox One for I think it was uh Christmas or something. And then after that, I got fired, so I had to palm my Xbox for been there. Oh man. Oh yeah, I done did that. Yeah, I'm like, well, it's a no-brainer. Um, you know what I'm saying? I'm gonna pick this back out at some point. Right. Right. I'm like, my son need, you know, diapers or formula or both.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:51

And I would sit there when we would have our, you know, back and forth. So I'm like, when I was when I was out there on the road picking up formula, this is when, you know, Walmart was 24 hours. I'm like, when I was on them Walmart runs at four or five in the morning, it was no other dads on the road with me. I was out there by myself doing, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. And it was like, you know, I didn't I didn't had to, just like we talked about, the the mental uh not being all the way there and still going, you know, doing what I gotta do in these moments. I'm just like, I'm learning. Yeah. Uh you gotta understand, both of my sons was born in 2014. My my oldest was born January 4th, and my youngest son was born December 11th. So you gotta think about those birthdays, Christmas and everything in between, and then the fact that my pops died the following year. So I'm all over the place. Like, I'm just you know what I'm saying, like nobody even thinking to ask or under how to understand me in these moments. Yeah, but I'm just like, okay, all I know how to do is be there for people. Right. So it's nothing for me to just still be there for myself. I'm like, well shit, I ain't got a job. I'm gonna potty train. You know what I'm saying? Um I'm just doing everything, I'm teaching them how to cook, I'm just doing whatever. Like, hey, just watch me do this. Learn this because I want y'all to be self-sufficient. I don't want y'all to have to, you know what I'm saying, depend on somebody to do this for y'all. Um, when it comes to them, you know, wearing their clothes or, you know, getting dressed, I'm like, look, don't wait on me or your mama to tell you how to do this. This is when they three, four, or five. It's like repetition though. I'm like, look, up colors, put them together, match this together.

SPEAKER_03 1:38:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:01

Don't come out with green and red and black, like you're not a watermelon, bro. Like, just you know what I'm saying? Like, grab proper clothing. Don't don't just run out because you want to go somewhere. Go hop in the shower, bro. You still gonna be able to get to go somewhere. You know what I'm saying? Be respectful where you go. People might want you back around, you know what I'm saying? Don't don't fall in line with the other kids because they acting out, right? You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_03 1:38:31

So and that's the stuff that matters, like you said, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:35

Right. So it's more so with me, it's like lead by example. I didn't even really know, I didn't really know how to lead by example, but I was just trying stuff. Cause it was like I didn't have that figure. My pops was for sure in my life, but the type of man that I am, it's a little bit different. It's a little bit different. So it's certain stuff, certain ways that he did stuff. I'm like, I gotta unlearn because he was born in the 50s. You feel me? So I'm like, whole different look on life. Yeah. I'm like, we ain't, we in the digital world. We in the beginning of the digital world for real at the at this point when I'm bringing my kids up. So it's a whole lot more, like, even just all these ring cameras and teaching them like, look, you can't be out here just acting up.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:29

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:30

Everything you act up in school, guess what? They watch you. Yep. The board of education watching you, the teachers watching you, the police watching you. So if you grow up and then catch a case of something, they could go back and say, well, you was a problem child in third grade, in fourth grade, and sixth grade, in eighth grade. Yep, exactly. So it's like it just got me to that point where I'm just like, you know what? We gotta figure this out. You know what I'm saying? We gotta, we gotta do a little more. Um so hold on, where where am I at with this one? Um that's where we at? Alright, bad. Oh, so yeah, that's where I was at. What what do you think is like the defining moment in your life that like really made you who you are today?

SPEAKER_03 1:40:32

Yeah, I'm gonna have to be already.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:36

Okay, all right. Definitely moment that made me who I am today. Man. That's that's tough because I I feel like who we are is made up of multiple moments. Um and so it's like I I I I I can think of many of them. Like, you know, sparring with my dad at 1415 is like made me the type of man I am. You know, being held at gunpoint at three in the morning walking home, you know, that that that's made me who I am. Um deciding to fall in love with her and and having to rebel against an entire congregation.

SPEAKER_03 1:41:24

Oh you make it sound like a movie or it wasn't everybody, it was what was it, 300?

SPEAKER_01 1:41:34

Uh 80% of the church, 80% is still alive. A couple people like 20% that's crazy of the church. Um, you know, they feeling hey, listen. Um yeah, I mean, man, just the the places I've gone, the things I've seen, I think those things make me who I am. I think defining moment, um, I'm not sure if there's like a particular one exactly that like stands out above the rest. Um but I think the ones I listed are like some of the things some of the ones that that that were important. Um there are people, you know what I'm saying, that made me who I am today. You know, um, you know, interactions with people um who come and gone. Um she herself has made me who I am. Um my daughter has like I think there are stages in which there are um, you know, like when they say like between one and five and and six and ten, and then eleven and fifteen and sixteen twenty one, like there are there are there are stages where I feel like there were things that happened in those years that led me to being who I am, but I think what I will say is um my the the one thing about myself is I I have this like not this like never give up type of mentality. I have this like do it all, persevere, through it all, push through it all and win type of personality that that that is true to who I am. Um and I think that came from because I think that's just my core. So I think that one thing um ties to there was a teacher that I had in middle school. Her name is Miss Smith. Um shout out to her if she is still alive and doing well. Um Miss Smith told me, um, I remember I was a class clown in school because I didn't really, I wasn't really popular and I didn't have a lot of friends, and I didn't really have a lot of confidence, and so I thought the best way to be accepted and not be bullied was to just be the fool. So that I entertained the people who would be the bullies, and that kept bullies off my back, but then it also made me interesting to people who probably were popular, and then it made me cooler than the kids who were delaying. So I remember this one particular day in school. I've made this huge fool of myself. I'm acting I'm trying to be funny, I'm cracking jokes, I'm acting out. And I remember Miss Smith pulled me to the side. The class was leaving, and she said, you know, she's like, Miss Parker, come here, can I talk to you? It was just me and her. And Miss Smith was a black lady who, older black lady, she used to always wear a lot of African stuff, like sheikis of different kinds, African dresses, she'd wear hair pieces, she was very pro-black. Yeah, and um I remember she was like uh she pretty much was like, Do you not understand your worth? And of course, I'm I'm trying to joke through that even because it's too it's a serious moment. I'm like, what do you mean, Miss? Of course I know my word, you know, and she was like, you know, she was like, Mince, you you're so smart, you're smarter than most people in this class, and I think you know that, I think they know that. That's why I think they they they like that you act this way because you're dumbing down yourself on their behalf. And she was like, um I wish you saw yourself the way that I see. And she was like, I think you're so talented, you have such a great energy, you have such great life, you're such a good kid. She was like, I just hate to see you waste your waste all that goodness trying to be somebody you're not. And she was like, I don't know if you know, but you're a fell in my class. She was like, and I want to see you pass. Because I don't want to see you repeat, and I don't want to see you on the corner one day. And she was like, if only you applied yourself just an ounce of as much as you make a fool of yourself, you truly understand how gifted you are. Yeah, and I was like, dang, like, of course, I'm feeling like shit. Like, I'm like, damn, Miss Smith. Like, you know what I'm saying? And um, and I remember that like eighth grade season. She told me that like seventh grade, I remember in eighth grade season, that's when I ran track. I got into drama class. I started doing a lot of different things and really kind of just betting a little bit on myself for the things that I thought were true to me. And I remember when I graduated, Miss Smith, um, we were all at the graduation in our auditorium at our school, and Miss Smith uh I hugged her on stage. And she was just like, go be great. And I was like, Alright. You know what I'm saying? And Miss Smith was there, there were other teachers who had like in elementary, there was a teacher who told me I could be a great writer one day because I wrote something in fifth grade. Yeah. Or something that she thought was really great. She was like, you know, I was a little fifth grade, and she was like, Vince, you you go, you can be a great writer one day. You know, but Miss Smith in middle school was the one person that she was one of the teachers, I should say. I think maybe there's a handful of teachers I vividly remember who said things to me that were very impactful. That at different ages in school I just didn't get. And even when I did understand it, I wasn't trying to take it in. But Miss Smith that always stuck with me because it wasn't that what she said was so profound. It's how sad she looked when she said it. She looked so disappointed and so sad that it felt like my mom was telling me. And I remember just seeing this like the sadness in her face. And even when she was done, she was like, that's all. She went back to work, and I just walked out the room and went to lunch and was like, ah, like, but even from that moment, like every class with her, I would just notice, like, I would look at it with this thing of like, wow, Miss Smith. Like, I just started being different. Even in just her class, I had I was gonna be different. Like, yeah, and so man, she hugged me, she told me to go, she was just like, go be great, Mr. Park. Yeah, and that was something that always soaked with me was to go and just be great. And and and I took that with me, that confidence that she had in me. I always say my confidence is self-delusional, because I think I'm the most very much like doubtful person. Like I'll be like, man, I don't, there are a lot of times I don't believe in myself more than people think. But I think that I move with such an overbloated confidence because of people like Miss Smith who expect me to be great to this day. You know what I'm saying? And so I've always had this fearless attitude, fearless mindset, fearless approach because there are people who have told me I am great. Yeah, they've said, like, you're gonna be great, you can be great, I see it. And so I move with that confidence, even when I don't believe it in myself. I know that there are people who who have like stared me into my souls, like, you're not seeing the power yet. And so as I got older, I just started moving in that confidence, and that confidence is. Has done wonders and allowed me to do great things. But I think that was a turning point. Miss Smith was a very much turning point where it was this black lady for some reason that was telling me something that I was like, I've heard this before. And I'm gonna hear it again by other people. But if there's anybody I ever believed meant it when they said it, it was her. And it's because of what she said and how she said it, and that she wasn't saying it like uh in an angry voice, or she was saying it in a not even in a disappointment tone, even though I know she was disappointed. She said it more in a I'm hurt that you don't even see it. Like that you're so blind to the greatness in you, Mr. Partner. Yeah, that saddens me because I see it. Yeah, and I see what you're doing to mask it. Right. And it was like that to me was like, if there's anybody that ever first believed in me that I believed, I think of Miss Smith. So I I I don't think, again, I think there are so many other opportunities and people who have done things that were defining moments that got me to where I am today. But I think of the most powerful one early on, um, that truly like when I look back, I'm like, wow, I remember as a kid sitting with that for like a week was Miss Smith in middle school at Lancaster Hughes Academy. I should have gone first. Oh, now you're now you're like, yeah. I've had man in my life be like a movie sometimes, but it's not on purpose. It's just like I I'm such an introspective person, man, that when I think about those moments, like they were critical.

SPEAKER_03 1:51:46

Man, and see that's what I'm still learning to do is to be introspective. Because, like I said, I feel like I just go from one thing to the decks, the decks. I don't really just sit in it, yeah. Let stuff sink in. Yeah. Um, so when you ask that question, I'm like, ha ha. Nothing really comes to mind. Uh, I would have to agree with you. I do think it was just like different people when I came into your life. Well, you for sure. You for sure definitely helped bring a lot of that out. But in different aspects, I think there were other people that brought out different aspects. Like, I've always been good in school, I've always been a good student. Granted, I was quiet too, so like they would have to pick on me to answer questions in class. But I always did well in school, but because I did well in school, it almost made me feel like that's all I could do. That makes sense. So some of the other things I was interested in, I kind of like downplayed it. Right. Because I'm like, oh well, everybody just says I'm good at school. Maybe I should just do school.

SPEAKER_01 1:52:53

Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:54

Um, so there were certain things that I missed out on, you know, as I went through school because I was like, well, I might not be good at it because nobody's saying I'd be good at it.

SPEAKER_01 1:53:03

Type thing. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:05

Um, but I always love music, always love music and or like being creative. And I get that for both my mom and my dad. But I think musically, though, I was always interested in it, but I just wasn't confident in my ability to do it. Um, and I remember my music teacher in fifth grade. Fifth grade is the common denominator here. These teachers pouring into us. But I I auditioned for this play, and it was like a real like laid back part, and I was fine with it. I'm like, all right, my foot is kind of in the door, but you know, I'm still in the back. Right. And then something happened where I ended up being the main role. And I was like, wait a minute, how did this happen? This ain't really what I was trying to do. But again, I did it scared, and my teacher, he really supported me and encouraged me to do it, and I had to sing a solo. And I think it was at that moment I was just like, yeah, this is something I want to do. I gotta keep doing this. This is something I want to do. And then from then on, as far as like music, I was always interested in it. I was in choir. Even with Randy, like Randy pulled even more, our minister of music pulled even more out of me because I was just in the choir. I was just singing alto, whatever. But he was like, Miss Parker, I know you got more in you. You should be singing solos too. I'm like, no, no, no. I'm standing back. Let me stand them back.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:40

Man.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:41

But even in that, he pulled that out of me. And then you, hey, you want to sing on this song? No, I just sing at church. Uh-uh. I need you to sing on this song. And then it's like the rest is history is fur as me singing on stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:54:55

Hey, listen, uh Bro's favorite album is Say Lesson. You you do a lot of singing on that, boy.

SPEAKER_03 1:55:00

You have you put me to work on that.

SPEAKER_01 1:55:02

You do a lot of singing on Say Less.

SPEAKER_03 1:55:04

Put me to work on that. But like you said, it's just something that I never saw myself in that way, or how that would encourage or affect people way back when I was just sitting on it. Right. I was just sitting on that. And again, around the time, it was because my dad died when I was in fifth grade too. And he was like my main like source when it came to like music and singing and all that type of stuff. So I would literally, I kind of it did kind of put me in a shell where I would just sing to myself, or I would just sing in my room, or again, I would just be kind of humming around the house, but I wasn't full out with it. So after my dad died, the fifth grade teacher, and then again our minister of music, brother Randy, and then you, like, y'all just kind of brought it out and then some. So it was just like for me, because I'm so like work-oriented, you do get like tunnel vision and thinking that's all there is to you. But y'all kind of again reminded me of like, no, there's more to you than that. Like, you can be creative, you can, you know, find freedom, and you know, just being open to do different things. So I would say that for me was like defining moments because again, it just made me acknowledge a part of myself that I wasn't uh valuing or putting work to, like I was really limiting myself. Because again, music has always been like a thing for me. Whether I'm doing my homework to the music playing, like again, it's just interwoven into like all the stuff that I do. So yeah, you guys kept that part alive.

SPEAKER_00 1:56:46

Nice, nice. Well, we uh at the end of it. I you know, got that last wellness check. How y'all feeling?

SPEAKER_01 1:56:56

Good, man. Just uh smashed all them goldfish for the listeners. You know, was over here smashing them goldfish. Feeling great, man. He's gonna have to answer to the boss. It'll be alright. It'll be alright. He said his kids don't owe him nothing. My kids owe me. Owe me them goldfish. No. I feel good, man. Glad to do, glad to do another good pie. Glad that we could, you know. Um, again, it feels like we we we done barely scraped the surface of the conversation for real. We be we be going so far, I'd be like, man, we didn't even get to no look, no love for real, for real. We we we kind of touched on it. I mean we gotta come back. Hey, guess what? I mean y'all gotta tap into the that means y'all gotta tap into the uh our podcast, the uh for better or worse, and then some. Listen, I had to remember tap into our podcast for better or worse, and then some on the retreat productions network, me and uh the boy wife Pierce as we uh talk about marriage and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:05

And then some.

SPEAKER_01 1:58:06

And then some. There you go, that was fire. So yeah, definitely. And then y'all gotta come back for part three.

SPEAKER_00 1:58:13

Part three? Y'all got the first part three in history, you know what I'm saying? The first part three in history. I don't know nobody that had a part three. I'm just saying. We did part two, we didn't tie with Big Rob, nah. I'm just saying part three. Cause look, you you you speaking on love and all that, right? You think I don't got questions about love up in the archives? In the archives ready? All right, I'm just saying. I just didn't really want to get to that because yeah, this because this the thing. When we did this one tonight, I really was just going off of y'all's vibe. So I really, you saw my questions was on the my questions was sitting right next to me. I didn't even touch them for a minute. So I'm like, damn, they cooking. So who would I be to not come with my spatula and you know what I'm saying? You feel me? You know what I'm saying? You know my top chef. So yeah, so hey, part three. Part three on the way. But um, so last question of the night. What would y'all, what type of advice would y'all give to someone that's mentally in the box? Like it ain't even necessarily that somebody else is putting them in the box, but they might have a low self-esteem, or they just overthinkers and they just don't know what's what. It's like it's getting the best of them.

SPEAKER_01 1:59:44

Um, I'm gonna go first because I know I'll be long-winded, so I'm gonna try to make this short like I did last time. Um man, somebody once told me that the grave is full of shoulda, coulda, woulda. And either you can go to the grave accomplished, or you can go to the grave, shoulda, coulda, woulda. And the casket is already wood. So just coulda shoulda. And I was like, um, I don't want that. You know what I'm saying? I know so many people that I I always hear, man. I was man, I was about to, man, I always wanted to, man, I would've liked it to, but I don't want to ever be that person, right? I at least want to say I did. I tried. I went for. I I attempted. And when I think of you know my daughter and raising her, how can I ever tell her what she can't do if all she sees is everything that I can? She has to see what I can do, right? And what I tried to do and attempted to do, and that will inspire her to do what she can.

SPEAKER_02 2:01:11

Right.

SPEAKER_01 2:01:12

And you know, even like, you know, with this pod, you know, you're doing a fantastic job. Sure. Um I'm not even in a position to help you do this pod, uh, you know, with everything that we do behind the scenes. If I don't take a chance on myself.

SPEAKER_02 2:01:35

Right.

SPEAKER_01 2:01:36

So again, thinking that my life is only unto my own, I realizing my life is a part of a shared experience. Facts. That if I don't do my part, maybe I'm holding up somebody else from doing theirs. If I don't chase after my thing, maybe I'm stopping someone else's blessing. Facts. So, with that type of pressure, how can I even feel comfortable knowing I'm not doing my thing? And my works, though will be forgotten one day or whatever, still will mean and live on longer than me. Right. And what kind of works do I want to leave behind? Or what kind of things do I want to leave behind with my name attached to it? Besides just saying, you work, and you work, you know, and I've been I've been to funerals like that where somebody was just like, they worked, and they worked for 50 years, and they worked. You know what I'm saying? And it's like, that's it. You know, I think one of the things that kind of jogged my my mind into realizing like there had to be more was um at you know certain said location which we both put that on the shirt. Right, in which that we both uh participated in being in, you know what I'm saying, and working. Uh you you remember um uh old man by the name of Will. Man. Old White Will. Old White Will. And Will was my guy. Yeah. And you know, Will had been there forever. Mm-mm. Will did everything they asked him to. Yeah. Everything he they didn't ask him to. You know what I'm saying? Right. Will Will just he worked, he was he was old Vietnam, you know what I'm saying? He worked, he was a man's man. Is that the dude they used to wear the uh bandana, like a American flag bandana or something? Yeah, Joe the motorcycle. Yeah. His wife was Diane, you know, shout out to her. Yeah. Oh, I ain't know that. That's crazy. I didn't know that. Yep. And him and him and both, him and his lady both working at the same place, both committing in their older ages to this place. Yeah. And when we're gone, I think they I I they they said they they laid a vest on the cask. Like, and it was like, that's it. No moment of silence at the job. No cake. No day off for anybody who was close to him outside of his woman. Life goes on. That's when I realized. He worked. I can't do that. I don't wanna I don't wanna go and live a life where the best they could do for me is take the uniform that I wore most of my life. And try to send it back to the grave with me. I don't I already wore this to the grave. I ain't trying to. Hey bro, cut it. I ain't trying to wear it in the grave. You feel me? So if that's the best if that's the best life can do for me. Something can pop up in the afterlife that said location. That said location. Talking about welcome to heaven. Hell no, welcome to hell. You know what I'm saying? Doug, that's insane. More angels, less demons, or whatever. Save money, you live better. Listen.

SPEAKER_03 2:05:38

Oh no, not crazy. You supposed to be. It's not this close.

SPEAKER_01 2:05:50

You know, hey, listen. Oh my god. But you know, if they didn't know, not if they didn't know, and if you still know, the such sad location, but yeah, man, it's stuff like that, man, where you just, you know, you see that and you just like, man, if that's if that's the best legacy I can leave behind at a bare minimum, why not take a chance on something crazy? Why not bet on something impossible? Because what is possible is is is go be uh bare minimum and best for feeling like a well job for your life. You know what I'm saying? So that's uh my that's my thing, man. Don't don't go to the grave with your woulda, coulda, shoulda's. Take a chance, bet on something crazy, and and and and enjoy living out that craziness of like I'm trying to do something crazy and different. Right, right. We've seen the pattern for how many decades and years and centuries of what the average toll working worker gets at the end of it. Yeah. Try try to be willing and courageous enough to be crazy and do something different.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:04

Yeah. So um, to add to what you have already said, so about socialist location or I was gonna say for somebody that is in the box, they just lost, they're not sure what to do. I would say, you know, what do you have to lose and what do you have to gain? If you try, you're still gonna be where you are. And if you try, you succeed, you'll move forward a little bit. You take a step towards what you want to do. I would say you won't fail unless you try, you won't learn unless you fail.

SPEAKER_01 2:07:40

Hey, so you just have to gotta.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:49

And so many people have failed. Right. Uh, and their lives have been better for it. Um, again, failing is not a loss, but you know, when you fail, you get the opportunity to learn. Um, I would just encourage them again to just like you said, just try. Right. Like there's no harm in trying. Um, and again, it just opens you the opportunity to learn.

SPEAKER_01 2:08:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:18

So yeah, that's what I try to do with Kobe. Like, girl, you just gotta try.

SPEAKER_01 2:08:24

For sure.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:24

Just try to teach her to try. Like, again, you might not get it that first time, but that second, third, fourth time, I mean, you might get it.

SPEAKER_01 2:08:32

Repetition's right. Mm-hmm. Yeah. That's real. That's real. And and you know, be patient. For sure. You know what I'm saying? If if if I think you a great example of it, bro. Like, you you wanted to do this for so long, and it's easy to feel like on that first time trying that if it don't work out the way you want to, you just give up. Throw it away. But sometimes it's time, and sometimes you you you gotta wait for the right season to align for things to work out. So it's like be patient. You know, if it if it's not your time now, maybe it's down the road. You know what I'm saying? And and when it's your time, then seize it. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 2:09:12

And so, yeah. But you know what's crazy though? You could feel like um in these moments that you might not saying you, I can't project that you felt this way, but I'm just saying like where you could feel like, what's my purpose? You could feel like your life is not maybe where you want at a certain point in life. And little do you know, it's no telling where my life goes without your life aligning the way it needs to be. You know what I'm saying? Because I'm like, ain't no telling if or when I would have ever started a podcast. Because you know, we already did the first one. Right. But it's no telling when I ever would have started, it's no telling when I ever would have jumped on another track. It ain't no telling when I would have got in the film, or you know what I'm saying, if that would have even been possible, if I would have had the uh energy to want to do it. Right. So I'm just like, it's just crazy how our lives align. It's like intertwine with each other, but then it's like it has to align within ourselves in order for other people to get to where they need to go.

SPEAKER_02 2:10:26

Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_01 2:10:27

You know, I mean, even like when you think of just, you know, even how we met at such last location. Um like we was we was cool, like in passing. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I felt like there were probably other people you were more cooler with there than me. Yeah. You know, I just see you in past, hey, and you know, that was it. You know what I mean? And it it it it even it kind of like slowly developed over time, yeah, to where like I was like, I think we actually cool. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, and so you think like, man, just how many people have we worked with there that's like we not that locked in like with them people, like you get what I'm saying? But we all had that opportunity to meet somebody and be locked in with somebody, and and it's just like you meet who you supposed to meet. Right. And then you the people who stay and stick around are the ones who supposed to stay and stick around. And it's like, like you say, everything has to line up, man. Like, my opportunity to work at such said location was between that and like Macy's at the same time. Yeah, and I remember calling her and being like, I got an offer from Macy's and this other place. Like, I'm trying to figure out which one I should take. And if I take Macy's, we never meet. You get what I'm saying? Like, so it's like everything is like, man, just it's it's It's things that you realize like are bigger than ourselves. Yeah. Decisions and choices that are bigger than ourselves. That if we don't make them, if we don't take them, if we don't, you know, step out, whatever. You know what I'm saying? Like, if I don't even reach out to you and tell you about my my album, yeah. You don't be like, hey, bro, this was dope. Yeah. I think I got a different respect for bro. Like, yeah. Hey, what else you got going on? Like, it all those things. If I'm not like, hey, I'm shooting Daphidus, all those things, like everything you just realize, like, if I don't do what I'm supposed to be doing, if I'm not in alignment, that's why when you know people used to tell me I was wrong for doing these things, like, this is crazy. Why are you wasting your time shooting the mood? Because I'm building relationships with people who I probably wouldn't have never. Who are people who have invested in me, people who I'm investing in them. These are people who I can call on to this day that I need. Like, if I don't do these things, then all that stuff doesn't happen. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So it's like it everything plays a purpose and a role for things, and that's why it's so important that you never be afraid to take a chance and bet on yourself. Facts. You know what I'm saying? So facts.

SPEAKER_00 2:13:16

Well, this has been a great pod. Um you came to that conclusion. Some people in your life for a reason, some people in your life for a season. You know what I'm saying? So message. With that being said, you know what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 2:13:33

Some such letter said locations are temporary.

SPEAKER_00 2:13:38

Uh no cap. Until you need to go back. No cap. But no, I ain't gonna lie though. I like how we cook. I like how we cook. Great episode. Yeah, but it always is. That's why we're gonna have the first part three in history. You know what I'm saying? Looking forward to it. And we can get to the, you know, more sort of marriage uh questions that I've had. But we've been cooking on some therapy though. Cooking on some therapy. And that's just the thing. I like the different dynamics that we bring with each episode. It's not you never know what you're gonna get just like tonight. I thought that I was gonna go with what I already had. Then I'm like, hold on, let me see if I could do this without looking. You know what I'm saying? So I'm like, you know what? I'm liking this. So uh yeah, we're gonna just keep cooking. Like I say, we're gonna get to the the the netty gritty next time on the the marriage questions because I do got a lot of great ones on that too. For sure, for sure. Um but yeah, this has been therapy in motion with the greatest host of all time, King OJ, aka the Zen Master. Then right across from I got the infamous Paris and Vance, you know what I'm saying? The big three in here. A time we gonna cook. You know what I'm saying? So hey, until next time, we out.